{"id":1607,"date":"2019-04-07T22:09:34","date_gmt":"2019-04-07T22:09:34","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.shiurpoints.com\/?p=1607"},"modified":"2026-10-26T18:04:51","modified_gmt":"2026-10-26T18:04:51","slug":"mikvaos-siman-201-shiur-10-04-03-2019","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.shiurpoints.com\/?p=1607","title":{"rendered":"Mikvaos, Siman 201, Shiur 10 04\/03\/2019"},"content":{"rendered":"

Mikvaos, Siman 201, Shiur 10<\/span><\/p>\n

March 03, 2019<\/span><\/p>\n

1- We went through many topics, here is a brief recap. <\/span><\/p>\n

In Seif 11 the topic was when a \u05de\u05e2\u05d9\u05df touches a pool of \u05de\u05d9\u05dd \u05e9\u05d0\u05d5\u05d1\u05d9\u05dd. This connection changes the status of the pool into a \u05de\u05e2\u05d9\u05df. Similar to the way most \u05de\u05e7\u05d5\u05d5\u05d0\u05d5\u05ea have been built in the last few hundred years. A \u05d1\u05d5\u05e8 \u00a0of \u05de\u05d9\u05dd \u05e9\u05d0\u05d5\u05d1\u05d9\u05dd is \u2018kashered\u2019 by touching a \u05d1\u05d5\u05e8 of \u05de\u05d9 \u05d2\u05e9\u05de\u05d9\u05dd. Thus the \u05d1\u05d5\u05e8 turns into a kosher mikvah.<\/span><\/p>\n

<\/p>\n

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2- Seif 12 spoke about a \u05de\u05e2\u05d9\u05df that flows over the back of a \u05db\u05dc\u05d9. Another topic was the prohibition of not \u05d8\u05d5\u05d1\u05dc\u05d9\u05df while standing on a \u05db\u05dc\u05d9, due to the concern that one may come to\u00a0\u05d8\u05d5\u05d1\u05dc in the\u00a0\u05db\u05dc\u05d9.<\/span><\/p>\n

\"Image<\/p>\n

back side of ceramic tile<\/em><\/p>\n

We discussed the history of placing ceramic or marble tiles on the walls and the floor on a mikvah. When these tiles arrived in Europe about 200 years ago the issue was raised because of the grooves on the back of the tiles. If the groove can hold water then that side of the tile is considered a \u05db\u05dc\u05d9. So when these tile are placed on the floor of the mikvah then the person standing on them is standing on the back of a \u05db\u05dc\u05d9! <\/span><\/p>\n

\"Image<\/p>\n

ancient Italian\u00a0 tile<\/em><\/p>\n

Some \u00a0Poskim had no issue with this at all. And here they introduced a Halocho from Hilchos \u05e1\u05d5\u05db\u05d4. <\/span><\/p>\n

One cannot use any item that is a \u05db\u05dc\u05d9 \u00a0for \u05e1\u05db\u05da. Now a ladder is not considered a \u05db\u05dc\u05d9 since its side poles and rungs have no \u05d1\u05d9\u05ea \u05e7\u05d9\u05d1\u05d5\u05dc.\u00a0 Meaning they cannot hold anything, such solids or water since t<\/span>hey are flat pieces of wood.<\/p>\n

\"Image<\/p>\n

Nevertheless some say one should <\/span>not <\/b>use a ladder as \u05e1\u05db\u05da . Why? Because the rungs were put into holes drilled into the beams (sides) of the ladder. The holes therefore designate the ladder as a \u05db\u05dc\u05d9.<\/span><\/p>\n

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\"\"<\/a><\/p>\n

See here from the Alter Rebbe’s Shulchan Aruch. 629, 11.\u00a0<\/a><\/span><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

A ‘holeless’ ladder<\/p>\n

But others responded since the holes were only hollow temporarily, and more\u00a0 so, the holes are intended to be filled by the rungs<\/strong>. Therefore the entire ladder is not a \u05db\u05dc\u05d9.<\/span><\/p>\n

Based on the above, because the grooves on the tiles are made specifically to be filled with cement or plaster they are not to be designated as proper holes and a \u05db\u05dc\u05d9. <\/span><\/p>\n

\"Image<\/p>\n

The short of it is that despite the above tiles used today have no grooves or lettering on the back of the tile.<\/p>\n

3- From here we moved on to Seif 13 – concerning the plugging of a hole with something that is \u05de\u05e7\u05d1\u05dc \u05d8\u05d5\u05de\u05d0\u05d4. Then to Seif\u00a0 14 and 15 and the issue with 3 Lugin that fell into a Mikvah that has less than 40 So\u2019h. <\/span><\/p>\n

\"Image<\/p>\n

We learnt the Mishnah in \u00a0\u05e2\u05d3\u05d9\u05d5\u05ea concerning the three way Machlokes about the amount of \u05de\u05d9\u05dd \u05e9\u05d0\u05d5\u05d1\u05d9\u05dd that renders a Mikvah (that does not have 40 So\u2019h) to be \u05e4\u05e1\u05d5\u05dc. <\/span><\/p>\n

Here is the Mishnah. <\/span><\/p>\n

Mishnah Eduyot 1 ,3<\/span><\/p>\n

\u05d4\u05dc\u05dc \u05d0\u05d5\u05b9\u05de\u05b5\u05e8, \u05de\u05b0\u05dc\u05b9\u05d0 \u05d4\u05b4\u05d9\u05df \u05de\u05b7\u05d9\u05b4\u05dd \u05e9\u05c1\u05b0\u05d0\u05d5\u05bc\u05d1\u05b4\u05d9\u05df \u05e4\u05bc\u05d5\u05b9\u05e1\u05b0\u05dc\u05b4\u05d9\u05df \u05d0\u05b6\u05ea \u05d4\u05b7\u05de\u05bc\u05b4\u05e7\u05b0\u05d5\u05b6\u05d4, \u05d0\u05b6\u05dc\u05bc\u05b8\u05d0 \u05e9\u05c1\u05b6\u05d0\u05b8\u05d3\u05b8\u05dd \u05d7\u05b7\u05d9\u05bc\u05b8\u05d1 \u05dc\u05d5\u05b9\u05de\u05b7\u05e8 \u05d1\u05bc\u05b4\u05dc\u05b0\u05e9\u05c1\u05d5\u05b9\u05df \u05e8\u05b7\u05d1\u05bc\u05d5\u05b9. <\/b><\/p>\n

Hillel says: A full <\/span>hin<\/span><\/i> [a measure equal to three <\/span>kabin<\/span><\/i>] of drawn water renders\u00a0<\/span>a ritual bath unfit. One is obligated to transmit [oral traditions] in the language of his master<\/b> [which explains why Hillel talks of hin<\/i> and not kav<\/i> units.<\/p>\n

\u05d5\u05b0\u05e9\u05c1\u05b7\u05de\u05bc\u05b7\u05d0\u05d9 \u05d0\u05d5\u05b9\u05de\u05b5\u05e8, \u05ea\u05bc\u05b4\u05e9\u05c1\u05b0\u05e2\u05b8\u05d4 \u05e7\u05b7\u05d1\u05bc\u05b4\u05d9\u05df.<\/b> Shammai says: Nine <\/span>kabin<\/span><\/i>. <\/span><\/p>\n

\u05d5\u05b7\u05d7\u05b2\u05db\u05b8\u05de\u05b4\u05d9\u05dd \u05d0\u05d5\u05b9\u05de\u05b0\u05e8\u05b4\u05d9\u05dd, \u05dc\u05b9\u05d0 \u05db\u05b0\u05d3\u05b4\u05d1\u05b0\u05e8\u05b5\u05d9 \u05d6\u05b6\u05d4 \u05d5\u05b0\u05dc\u05b9\u05d0 \u05db\u05b0\u05d3\u05b4\u05d1\u05b0\u05e8\u05b5\u05d9 \u05d6\u05b6\u05d4<\/b>, <\/span>\u00a0But the Sages said: Not like the words of [Hillel] and not like the words of [Shammai], <\/span><\/p>\n

\u05d0\u05b6\u05dc\u05bc\u05b8\u05d0 \u05e2\u05b7\u05d3 \u05e9\u05c1\u05b6\u05d1\u05bc\u05b8\u05d0\u05d5\u05bc \u05e9\u05c1\u05b0\u05e0\u05b5\u05d9 \u05d2\u05b7\u05e8\u05b0\u05d3\u05bc\u05b4\u05d9\u05bc\u05b4\u05d9\u05dd \u05de\u05b4\u05e9\u05bc\u05c1\u05b7\u05e2\u05b7\u05e8 \u05d4\u05b8\u05d0\u05b7\u05e9\u05c1\u05b0\u05e4\u05bc\u05d5\u05b9\u05ea \u05e9\u05c1\u05b6\u05d1\u05bc\u05b4\u05d9\u05e8\u05d5\u05bc\u05e9\u05c1\u05b8\u05dc\u05b7\u05d9\u05b4\u05dd \u05d5\u05b0\u05d4\u05b5\u05e2\u05b4\u05d9\u05d3\u05d5\u05bc \u05de\u05b4\u05e9\u05bc\u05c1\u05d5\u05bc\u05dd \u05e9\u05c1\u05b0\u05de\u05b7\u05e2\u05b0\u05d9\u05b8\u05d4 \u05d5\u05b0\u05d0\u05b7\u05d1\u05b0\u05d8\u05b7\u05dc\u05b0\u05d9\u05d5\u05b9\u05df, \u05e9\u05c1\u05b0\u05dc\u05b9\u05e9\u05c1\u05b6\u05ea \u05dc\u05bb\u05d2\u05bc\u05b4\u05d9\u05df \u05de\u05b7\u05d9\u05b4\u05dd \u05e9\u05c1\u05b0\u05d0\u05d5\u05bc\u05d1\u05b4\u05d9\u05df \u05e4\u05bc\u05d5\u05b9\u05e1\u05b0\u05dc\u05b4\u05d9\u05df \u05d0\u05b6\u05ea \u05d4\u05b7\u05de\u05bc\u05b4\u05e7\u05b0\u05d5\u05b6\u05d4, \u05d5\u05b0\u05e7\u05b4\u05d9\u05bc\u05b0\u05de\u05d5\u05bc \u05d7\u05b2\u05db\u05b8\u05de\u05b4\u05d9\u05dd \u05d0\u05b6\u05ea \u05d3\u05bc\u05b4\u05d1\u05b0\u05e8\u05b5\u05d9\u05d4\u05b6\u05dd:<\/b><\/p>\n

Until two water drawers came from the dung gate in Jerusalem and testified in the names of Shama’ya and Avtalion: Three <\/span>logim<\/span><\/i> [a measure equal to a quarter of a <\/span>hin<\/span><\/i>] of drawn water render a ritual bath unfit; and the Sages upheld [Shama’ya and Avtalion’s] words.<\/span><\/p>\n